Fassbinder

[Remember (Quaco)]

I've always been curious about his films. Where should I start?

[you have to have a fly's eye to see it]

Check out polls, critics' lists, etc. and they often go for Fear Eats The Soul as his best. It's a great film but not my own favourite - and it might not draw you in to his oeuvre as much as others.

His first two feature-length films are wonderful and I think they're both to your taste, Jim. Love Is Colder Than Death and Gods of the Plague (both from 1969) are short (<90 minutes) black-and-white dramas with very strong, sombre moods and altho' they were supposedly influenced by the French New Wave (among others), they're quite unique. They stay with you long after viewing.

Actually the Godard thing does come across quite a bit in this trailer (for Love Is Colder...):




One thing - it takes a bit of getting used to the naturalistic style of acting and sometime sparse dialogue. He really was different! There are (seemingly deliberate) scenes where the characters overdo things, or where their reactions are strangely muted. I haven't really looked into the ideas behind this much, but I know he used some sort of distancing effect (much like the strange colours/backdrops used in Vertigo, say).


I think others here could tell you more about some of his later films, as well as the recently-unearthed World On A Wire, and the series Berlin Alexanderplatz - but there's lots to get into.

[mentalist (slight return)]

Fear Eats The Soul, The Merchant of Four Seasons, Fox & His Friends. Effi Briest is probably one of his most conventional movies and is really good.

My faves are Berlin Alexanderplatz, & In A Year With Thirteen Moons, which is so poignant and sad and wonderful, it's very challenging to watch at times.

[geoffcowgill]

I think one of his last films, Lola, would be a great place to start. It's pretty accessible, as are the other two films in that BRD trilogy (Veronika Voss and Marriage of Maria Braun). I like Mother Kusters Goes to Heaven quite a bit, too.

[Remember (Quaco)]

Thanks for the suggestions! What do you like about his films? From what little I've seen, it almost seems to be a celebration of analogue film stock itself, like it doesn't matter so much what is happening on screen but oh it's so great to see it on film. But I don't know anything, that's just how it seemed ...

[mentalist (slight return)]

There's a moment in his career where he discovers Douglas Sirk and his films become more melodramatic and despairing, yet somehow uplifting. He worked with great women and presented them really well, if not a bit oppressed! Hanna Schygulla, Brigitte Mira and my fave Irm Hermann. But yeah the more eloquent film buffs here could say a lot more.

There's something about someone who was so uncompromising, making all those films as well as Berlin Alexanderplatz (not to mention the acting and theatre direction and writing), seemingly working himself to death before he was 40.

[you have to have a fly's eye to see it]

Hanna Schygulla was beautiful for a while.



I think what I like about Fassbinder's films are the way he says something about society in the 70s, and not just in Germany. He covers a lot of ground, he lets the characters speak for him and he doesn't necessarily taken any obvious sides.

He was a very sensitive soul and there's a richness to many of his films - they're very filmic, somehow. Sumptious. Often music is used to enhance, scenes can be breathtaking. And yet at the same time they're often very simple, the plot is usually straightforward, lots of melancholy.

The standard of acting is sometimes shockingly bad - at least that's how it looks to me. He plays a role himself sometimes and he's a total ham!

[Bleep]

Alexanderplatz is a quiet masterpiece. Gottfried John is wonderful in it.

[The G Experience!]

I can't contribute much because I've not seen many of his films (although oddly I've seen Fear Eats The Soul, about three times as I kept seeing it on tv) but I keep meaning to rectify that.
Some really interesting comments frrom posters. From what people say, they seem to have a lot in common with the films of Cassavetes..which is perhaps why Jimmy is interested in them.

[geoffcowgill]

I can't contribute much because I've not seen many of his films (although oddly I've seen Fear Eats The Soul, about three times as I kept seeing it on tv) but I keep meaning to rectify that.
Some really interesting comments frrom posters. From what people say, they seem to have a lot in common with the films of Cassavetes..which is perhaps why Jimmy is interested in them.

That's an interesting and, I think, apt comparison. I'm in the middle of Woman Under the Influence right now, and I could almost see it as a Fassbinder. There's that shambolic immediacy, where things are often just off enough to veer wildly between absolute naturalism and expressionistic stylization. With Cassavetes that tension is largely in the performances, but with Fassbinder it often seems part of the whole fabric, the script, camerawork, everything.

What Mentalist said is absolutely true, also. The mere idea of Fassbinder is intriguing. That any of his films are actually as good as many are is almost incredible.

[the masked man]

I think you should follow your nose, basically. After all, the first Fassbinder I ever saw was the epic serial of Berlin Alexanderplatz, which is forbidding and definitely not for the faint-hearted, but this only made me want to see more.

Of his feature films, I probably like The Bitter Tears of Petra Von Kant, The Marriage of Maria Braun and Veronika Voss the best, but I doubt he made any films that were without interest. His career, which lasted for something like 14 years, was unbelievably prolific (over 40 features), and everything he made was deeply personal and highly individual.

But, at some point, you will need to see Berlin Alexanderplatz.

[Snarfyguy]

The only one of his I've seen is Querelle - his last film.

I thought it was pretty unwatchable. But I'd like to see some of the earlier stuff.

[the masked man]

The only one of his I've seen is Querelle - his last film.

I thought it was pretty unwatchable. But I'd like to see some of the earlier stuff.

Yeah, that could be his worst film; I saw an English-dubbed video, and was pretty appalled. I'd say you need to see some of his other efforts, really.

[Sea Of Tunes v2.0]

There's a moment in his career where he discovers Douglas Sirk and his films become more melodramatic and despairing, yet somehow uplifting. He worked with great women and presented them really well, if not a bit oppressed! Hanna Schygulla, Brigitte Mira and my fave Irm Hermann. But yeah the more eloquent film buffs here could say a lot more.

There's something about someone who was so uncompromising, making all those films as well as Berlin Alexanderplatz (not to mention the acting and theatre direction and writing), seemingly working himself to death before he was 40.

Agree. Irm Hermann still does the odd bit part, to great effect. She doesn't appear to have aged in the last three decades. Most recent film I saw with her was a TV comedy... she played a slightly sadistic head nurse in a superb satire on the wellness industry (and capitalism in general) - and she was adorable at the same time (the obese PC who had to visit the wellness center fell in love with her at the end of the movie).

IIRC Faßbinder did not so much die from his workaholism, but from a heart attack brought about by severe alcohol and cocaine abuse. A tragic end for a great artist.

[mentalist (slight return)]

IIRC Faßbinder did not so much die from his workaholism, but from a heart attack brought about by severe alcohol and cocaine abuse. A tragic end for a great artist.

I understand drugs and drink were the cause of his death. But, not having read much about his life, I get a feeling he did everything at full tilt. In the early days he would have 2 or 3 films on the go at one time.

[Sea Of Tunes v2.0]

IIRC Faßbinder did not so much die from his workaholism, but from a heart attack brought about by severe alcohol and cocaine abuse. A tragic end for a great artist.

I understand drugs and drink were the cause of his death. But, not having read much about his life, I get a feeling he did everything at full tilt. In the early days he would have 2 or 3 films on the go at one time.

Oh yes. He was hyperactive. Perhaps the substance use was more like some form of self-medication, to suppress or channel his thought processes somewhat.

[algroth]

I don't think I have much to add by this point, but if you want to see something uncharacteristic in his catalogue check out the rather macabre and plain bonkers Chinese Roulette. A nice, riveting detour.

[Snarfyguy]

Criterion's just got World on a Wire, Fassbinder's 1970s sci-fi epic, out on DVD, which I've rented and begun watching (It's something like 3 1/2 hours long; I think it was originally a mini-series for television & so not meant to be consumed in a single sitting).

Right off the bat it's utterly engrossing, with a fantastic visual style. I'm really enjoying it!

[Captain Jazzmag]

I've always been curious about his films. Where should I start?

X-Men: First Class.

Do I win £5?

[The Write Profile]

Yeah, I did a paper on German Cinema as part of my degree and Fassbinder's films really stood out. Wenders was really bitter about the guy's self-destructive nature ("he fucking died on us", he incredulously told a Sight & Sound journalist, circa the release of Paris, Texas.), but it seems like he genuinely was one of those directors who threw his personality into everything he made and then tore it to the ground and started again. The Marriage of Maria Braun and Lola are explosive, striking works- the melodrama is amped so high that it's remarkable they don't go totally off the rails, but there is something about his commitment to tone that keeps them on a relatively even keel.

I like his talent for exaggerated naturalism, not to mention how lurid his colour schemes can be- particularly in Lola, which makes so much play of red it borders on self-parody. Armin Mueller-Stahl is terrific in it though- a naively idealist cowed, seduced and manipulated, but ultimately revealed to be as slippery as anyone else in the film, it's remarkable portrayal.

I guess you could argue that Fassbinder's lays on his themes pretty thick- you don't need to know much about post-war German history to pick the guy's targets , or get the impression that the supposed "economic miracle" was something of a sham that willfully ignored their recent past and made no effort to truly clean up the system. The cynicism and ire can be pretty damn exhausting at times, but in his best work, you always feel like you've seen something.